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Re: anybody else been spammed by "no-ip.com" yet?

  • From: Gregory Hicks
  • Date: Fri May 03 20:16:07 2002


> Date: Fri, 3 May 2002 15:27:08 -0700 (PDT)
> From: Scott Granados <scott@graphidelix.net>
> 
> I realize this statement I'm about to make is going to open a huge... 
> can o worms but ... and hoefully everyone knows I mean this in the most 
> friendly responsible way ever but I'm not sure entirely what the big 
> deal with spam is.  Honestly sure I get it like everyone else, in some 
[...snip...]
> money. Today with flat rate access and many people not paying on a per 
> packet basis it seems to me that the responsibility lies with the end 
> user to filter properly and or dress that delete key.  I always shut 
[...snip...]

The problem with this is that, yes, to the END USER, there is no direct
cost involved.

However, in order to maintain the same level of service, the ISP is
forced to go get a bigger pipe and/or bigger, faster routers and/or
servers.  (Raises prices a bit per account)

The transit provider raises the costs to the ISP because the packet
count has gone way up.

The backbone provider has equipment running a bit hotter because of the
increased packet count.  This may cause them to either increase the
bill to the transit provider and/or procure bigger and better equipment
(to handle the load) before their planned replacement time...

The peers to this ISP are forced to get either bigger pipes and/or more
costly equipment (routers) in order to handle the increased packet
count they might be seeing.

In all of this, the bozo (well..., 'user' really) originating the email
(well, spam) has not paid a thing other than a temporary interruption
in service for one of his throw-away accounts and is still paying a
'flat rate' for the POP (dial-in) service that HIS isp is providing.

For snail mail junk mail (aka spam), the mailer bears ALL of the costs
and, if there is insufficient returns on their junk mail, is forced to
stop.  A 'spammer' does not see these costs and thus has no incentive
to find another model to do business.

We get, for our 7K users, upwards of 25,000+ unwanted messages per day
that make it past our not so rigid filters.

My $0.02 worth.  Use the delete key...

Regards,
Gregory Hicks


> 
> On Fri, 3 May 2002, Mitch Halmu wrote:
> 
> > 
> > 
> > On Fri, 3 May 2002, Paul Vixie wrote:
> > 
> > > > I hate to sound like the big idiot here, but what exactly in the email
> > > > you received indicates no-ip.com spammed? It looks to me like you just
> > > > have some secret "admirer" who thought you wanted a no-ip.com account,
> > > > and no-ip.com emailed you to confirm that you do want the account.
> > > 
> > > spam is like pollution in that (a) whenever you're not sure if you're
> > > doing it, you probably are, and (b) if everybody did whatever it is,
> > > life would be universally worse for, well, everybody.
> > > 
> > > > Random disclaimer: Yes, we're a competitor of no-ip.com's... And yes, we
> > > > used to send similar emails to people signing up for an account,
> > > > although nowadays instead of sending them an initial password we send a
> > > > confirm URL instead.
> > > 
> > > that's the right approach.  no-ip's problem was they presumed my 
permission.
> > >
> > 
> > You don't even have to be in the "big idiot" league to figure out that in 
> > both the "wrong" and the "right" approach as sanctioned above by a higher 
> > authority, an email message (aka spam) is sent to the presumed subscriber.
> > 
> > One sends a password, one asks for permission to issue a password on their
> > site. What's the difference in the annoy factor, if indeed one were to be 
> > subscribed by a secret "admirer"?
> > 
> > Mr. Halmu chose to think, rather than bindly obey...
> > 
> > --Mitch
> > NetSide